Alex Smith Cut (update: retired)

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Well, the minute we "got rid of him" our offense tanked and we dwelled in the basement of suckatude. AS was a qb that you could develop the rest of the team around and still be a quality team. Fortunately, I think RR and company understood that, and once they could free themselves of DH, they used KA and AS to keep the qb spot from being a liability and taught the rest of the team how to play. Getting the qb spot right is such a huge undertaking for this offseason. Is it September yet?

our offense was never good with him. there was an obvious drop off from Cousins to Smith.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

our offense was never good with him. there was an obvious drop off from Cousins to Smith.

offensive production drop off maybe, better record definitely.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Actually, both teams drafted a better player and let him sit behind AS for a year. Neither team "got rid of him and drafted a better player". Had we drafted a better player in lieu of Haskins, we would be in terrific shape as AS' contract expired. But alas - Haskins...

I am only talking about KC. Facts are when Mahomes took over they won a SB and went to another. Would never have happened w/ Smith.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I am only talking about KC. Facts are when Mahomes took over they won a SB and went to another. Would never have happened w/ Smith.

But the team that Mahomes took over, and the time behind AS is credited toward his growth. They also made the playoffs with AS.

My point is, had Haskins been a good qb pick, maybe we would be in a different place, but now we are stuck in a qb quagmire. None of that is Alex Smith's fault. The games he played, our team had measurably better success.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

offensive production drop off maybe, better record definitely.

But again a QB W/L record is totally flawed. DeShawn Watson's W/L record this year was 4-12.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

But the team that Mahomes took over, and the time behind AS is credited toward his growth. They also made the playoffs with AS.

My point is, had Haskins been a good qb pick, maybe we would be in a different place, but now we are stuck in a qb quagmire. None of that is Alex Smith's fault. The games he played, our team had measurably better success.

Mahomes was going to be a great player. With or w/out Smith.

Also I am not knocking him. Solid guy as it gets, I just never thought much of him as a QB and would have never traded for him.

[AnonEmouse]

I'd say looking at the stats alone is misleading. Were we likely to be consistent playoff contenders with Smith? Possibly and maybe likely. Would be be SB contenders and even winners? Unlikely.

What he brought were intangibles like leadership and improving the guys around him. What he didn't do was sling the ball around and light up the scoreboard. As a rule he wasn't going to make catastrophic mistakes and dig us into holes, but likewise he wasn't likely to dig us out of holes others put us in. He was a good bridge QB, and our problem is we didn't give him a Mahomes to learn from him and be the other side o the bridge.

Listening to Heinicke, you get the distinct impression he made the other QB's better (or at least feel better about themselves), the exception being DH. And DH could probably come out of a meeting with Joe Montana or Tom Brady and gain nothing from it.

We need to find a franchise level QB with those intangibles, but with the tools and capability to go to the next level. Better football minds can decide who that is.

[JackLord]

Originally Posted by AnonEmouse

I'd say looking at the stats alone is misleading. Were we likely to be consistent playoff contenders with Smith? Possibly and maybe likely. Would be be SB contenders and even winners? Unlikely.

What he brought were intangibles like leadership and improving the guys around him. What he didn't do was sling the ball around and light up the scoreboard. As a rule he wasn't going to make catastrophic mistakes and dig us into holes, but likewise he wasn't likely to dig us out of holes others put us in. He was a good bridge QB, and our problem is we didn't give him a Mahomes to learn from him and be the other side o the bridge.

Listening to Heinicke, you get the distinct impression he made the other QB's better (or at least feel better about themselves), the exception being DH. And DH could probably come out of a meeting with Joe Montana or Tom Brady and gain nothing from it.

We need to find a franchise level QB with those intangibles, but with the tools and capability to go to the next level. Better football minds can decide who that is.

Great post. Mahomes said as much about Alex's mentorship. Alex is a class act and exemplifies "team player" in its purest sense.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

But again a QB W/L record is totally flawed. DeShawn Watson's W/L record this year was 4-12.

The difference, and the reason 11-4 means something tied to AS is because in 2 separate seasons, our team had 5 + wins with him starting qb, and in those SAME SEASONS we were 3-14 with out him. The reason the W/L record is significant is because the team and coaching around AS didn't significantly improve mid season to make his play insignificant, instead his play significantly impacted the play of the rest of the team to make the outcomes better.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I am only talking about KC. Facts are when Mahomes took over they won a SB and went to another. Would never have happened w/ Smith.

Exactly.
Again, none of this is a personal attack against Smith.
But that analysis is spot on.
Smith was way too conservative and just had no moxy when the chips were down. You were going to win 9-10 games with him some seasons, and go to the playoffs at times, but never the SB.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

The difference, and the reason 11-4 means something tied to AS is because in 2 separate seasons, our team had 5 + wins with him starting qb, and in those SAME SEASONS we were 3-14 with out him. The reason the W/L record is significant is because the team and coaching around AS didn't significantly improve mid season to make his play insignificant, instead his play significantly impacted the play of the rest of the team to make the outcomes better.

AS is above average. He is better than the scrubs we had. That doesn't mean he's the guy to lead you to a SB victory. He isn't. It is possible for him to improve W-L total when the rest of our QBs SUCK, and to be talented, but still be a world away from a SB winning QB. His playoff record is 2-5. Smith puts up lots of decent stats against average and losing teams and then hooches it when it counts, in significant measure because he is conservative to a fault and a checkdown QB. Trading for him was an AWFUL decision.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by AnonEmouse

I'd say looking at the stats alone is misleading. Were we likely to be consistent playoff contenders with Smith? Possibly and maybe likely. Would be be SB contenders and even winners? Unlikely.

What he brought were intangibles like leadership and improving the guys around him. What he didn't do was sling the ball around and light up the scoreboard. As a rule he wasn't going to make catastrophic mistakes and dig us into holes, but likewise he wasn't likely to dig us out of holes others put us in. He was a good bridge QB, and our problem is we didn't give him a Mahomes to learn from him and be the other side o the bridge.

Listening to Heinicke, you get the distinct impression he made the other QB's better (or at least feel better about themselves), the exception being DH. And DH could probably come out of a meeting with Joe Montana or Tom Brady and gain nothing from it.

We need to find a franchise level QB with those intangibles, but with the tools and capability to go to the next level. Better football minds can decide who that is.

Exactly. The question is did we hire those football minds? Our two GMs both got QB wrong consistently throughout their career. Hope they get it right though and draft a franchise QB.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Scalper

Exactly. The question is did we hire those football minds? Our two GMs both got QB wrong consistently throughout their career. Hope they get it right though and draft a franchise QB.

Our current staff brought Stafford, Newton, and PManning to their respective teams. How is that consistently getting it wrong.

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[mooby]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Our current staff brought Stafford, Newton, and PManning to their respective teams. How is that consistently getting it wrong.

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What draft pick did they have?

[MissouriSkin]

Originally Posted by mooby

What draft pick did they have?

What difference does that make? People have gotten it wrong with the first pick too since that’s what you’re implying. Ever heard of JaMarcus Russell? People have gotten all sorts of picks wrong....Ryan Leaf...Akili Smith....Johnny Manziel....Brady Quinn.....