Democratic Primary Push for White House

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

It really is hard to find those small points of agreement. I didn't look into any of it, so I will happily agree and move on.

I am far more interested to see how the Democratic Party resolves the moderate vs socialist split. Seems like a 3 way race at this point, Socialist Bernie vs Pete the Moderate vs Bloomberg the rich. I think Pete has the best chance to win the general election, but will the whole party back him.

As a moderate (doesnt everyone consider themselves a moderate? lol) .. it worries me to see the Democratic party move left. But are we?

AOC only represents a small pocket of NYC yet it seems she is "speaking for all liberals and democrats", when in fact she is not. She is an extreme brand. I do think AOC would vote for open borders and that idea is completely nuts to me. But I think that idea is completely nuts to 80% of the democratic party.I wish someone, Biden or Warren or Bloomberg would come out and say "open borders is not a realistic option".
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Bernie Sanders from his website:

Guarantee tuition and debt-free public colleges, universities, HBCUs, Minority Serving Institutions and trade-schools to all.
Cancel all student loan debt for the some 45 million Americans who owe about $1.6 trillion and place a cap on student loan interest rates going forward at 1.88 percent.
Invest $1.3 billion every year in private, non-profit historically black colleges and universities and minority-serving institutions
End equity gaps in higher education attainment. And ensure students are able to cover non-tuition costs of attending school by: expanding Pell Grants to cover non-tuition and fee costs, tripling funding for the Work-Study Program, and more.

^^ does this mean free college? Would students have to do well in school and placement tests first? Our taxes would certainly go up. The idea that a kid who didnt give a crap about school, just barely graduated would then be offered free college is crazy to me.

^^ 1.3B a year to HBCUs ... I think we can steer some money through grants or other programs but to give free money to schools seems non-productive.

End the housing crisis by investing $2.5 trillion to build nearly 10 million permanently affordable housing units.
Protect tenants by implementing a national rent control standard, a “just-cause” requirement for evictions, and ensuring the right to counsel in housing disputes.
Make rent affordable by making Section 8 vouchers available to all eligible families without a waitlist and strengthening the Fair Housing Act.
Combat gentrification, exclusionary zoning, segregation, and speculation.
End homelessness and ensure fair housing for all
Revitalize public housing by investing $70 billion to repair, decarbonize, and build new public housing.

^^ the waitlist in MD is 8 years or so, they arent even letting people on the list to my understanding ... if you make section 8 avail for all, immediately ... that number sounds astronomical to me.

Institute a moratorium on deportations until a thorough audit of past practices and policies is complete.
Reinstate and expand DACA and develop a humane policy for those seeking asylum.
Completely reshape and reform our immigration enforcement system, including breaking up ICE and CBP and redistributing their functions to their proper authorities.
Dismantle cruel and inhumane deportation programs and detention centers and reunite families who have been separated.
Live up to our ideals as a nation and welcome refugees and those seeking asylum, including those displaced by climate change.

^^ this is basically open borders to me. Anyone can walk in, say "asylum" and we accept them? Break up ICE? Suspend all deportations?



Create a Medicare for All, single-payer, national health insurance program to provide everyone in America with comprehensive health care coverage, free at the point of service.
No networks, no premiums, no deductibles, no copays, no surprise bills.
Medicare coverage will be expanded and improved to include: include dental, hearing, vision, and home- and community-based long-term care, in-patient and out-patient services, mental health and substance abuse treatment, reproductive and maternity care, prescription drugs, and more.
Stop the pharmaceutical industry from ripping off the American people by making sure that no one in America pays over $200 a year for the medicine they need by capping what Americans pay for prescription drugs under Medicare for All.

^^healthcare is still crazy expensive. I have a 4k deductible so basically I am paying my health ins costs every year. I guess if I have surgery and it is not deemed elective, ins will kick in ... one day.

I dont know what to do about health ins. I work hard, went through college and grad school and make good money ... so now my kid will get the same treatment, sitting in the same waiting room as a kid whose parents dont work and just sit around smoking cigarettes?

I imagine the wait to get out-patient appointments will be months and people will just walk into hospitals making them inpatient centers.
https://berniesanders.com/issues/
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Benrie is crazy to me and id not vote vs voting for him. The other Dems Id vote for.

[Giantone]

To hell with Bernie and Biden, I'd go Bloomberg

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Giantone

To hell with Bernie and Biden, I'd go Bloomberg

I can't see Bernie supporters voting for Bloomberg. Basically he is trying to buy the Democratic nomination (in the eyes of Bernie supporters)

[Buffalo Bob]

I think Biden is the only Democrat that stands a chance of beating Trump. If he wins the nomination I will probably vote for him and I vote Republican 99% of the time. If anyone else wins the Democratic nomination I will write in Will Seemore again. I have always thought 3rd party candidates were freaking insane.

[Chico23231]

So I’m a big JAMES Carville fan (saw him speak, met him, etc)....his positions, ability to see the issues and read the voter are all Jedi-like. I disagree with him on things, but he’s awesome.

So he gave an interview to Vox (certified garbage site) and nailed it once again. It’s a must read for anyone following politics, right or left. Carville is brilliant and 1000% right.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...james-carville

We’re losing our damn minds”: James Carville unloads on the Democratic Party

Favorite parts:

Can I say one more thing about the cultural disconnect?

Sean Illing
Sure.

James Carville
I want to give you an example of the problem here. A few weeks ago, Binyamin Appelbaum, an economics writer for the New York Times, posted a snarky tweet about how LSU canceled classes for the National Championship game. And then he said, do the “Warren/Sanders free public college proposals include LSU, or would it only apply to actual schools?”

You know how fucking patronizing that is to people in the South or in the middle of the country? First, LSU has an unusually high graduation rate, but that’s not the point. It’s the goddamn smugness. This is from a guy who lives in New York and serves on the Times editorial board and there’s not a single person he knows that doesn’t pat him on the back for that kind of tweet. He’s so fucking smart.

Appelbaum doesn’t speak for the Democratic Party, but he does represent the urbanist mindset. We can’t win the Senate by looking down at people. The Democratic Party has to drive a narrative that doesn’t give off vapors that we’re smarter than everyone or culturally arrogant.


This ^ is brilliant. this is where the Democratic Party lost a lot of folks, including me

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

I can't see Bernie supporters voting for Bloomberg. Basically he is trying to buy the Democratic nomination (in the eyes of Bernie supporters)

.........it worked for trump,............well that and putin.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Buffalo Bob

I think Biden is the only Democrat that stands a chance of beating Trump. If he wins the nomination I will probably vote for him and I vote Republican 99% of the time. If anyone else wins the Democratic nomination I will write in Will Seemore again. I have always thought 3rd party candidates were freaking insane.

Bidens toast.Warren and Bloomburg can both beat trump .Now if they were smart they would team up.

[sdskinsfan2001]

I don't see Trump losing to any of these candidates. But I never thought that Obama or Trump would ever be president either, so I'm no Vegas oddsmaker.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

I can't see Bernie supporters voting for Bloomberg. Basically he is trying to buy the Democratic nomination (in the eyes of Bernie supporters)

Is he not? What is his mission statement other than "I am a successful businessman ala Trump, but I'm not Trump." He's just throwing money at it that he can afford to lose, what solutions is he presenting to any of the problems facing real Americans today?

Also Sunny, I think you're doing a good job trying to reach across the aisle and bridge the gap between us and Chico/Cred, but Chico has a real hard-on for just pointing out media hypocrisy and inaccuracy instead of realizing both sides do that nowadays, both sides are going to keep churning out content anywhere from factual (Reuters/AP in my book) to cherry-picking/media spin (Breitbart/HuffPo). As long as people keep clicking, that's the goal. There's always going to be someone trying to pin blame or use a situation to promote a theory without evidence, and it's never going to change if you keep clicking/posting/sharing.

For the most part I find your positions reasonable, and I agree with most of them. I think we could do a way better job of healthcare in this country, in its' current form it places profit for the medical insurance/tech/supplier industries over human life. I think considering we have seen systems implemented in other first world countries it's reasonable to think we could implement a similar system here, one that doesn't bankrupt people who need major life-saving surgeries or raise the price of insulin/meds 5000% out of pure greed. But it would require winners and losers. Winners would be American citizens (note I didn't say illegals) for not paying $100 for a bag of saline solution in a hospital, or 140 grand for a snakebite needing anti-venom. Losers will be medical insurance for not making profits off healthy Americans who never visit the hospital, or pharma companies not jacking up the price of a life-saving medication 5000%.

I disagree with anyone who wants open borders. But I think families and parents who want to come to America to work hard to provide for their families shouldn't have to wait 10 years to get in. I'm fine taking that wall money and spending it on border agents or technology that makes their jobs easier, but implying it's going to do anything other than make it harder for illegal immigrants to cross is insane. It's not going to slow down Americans' insane appetite for illegal drugs. It's just going to make people pay more money to ride in the trunk of a car at a border crossing, or cross on a boat on the coast at the middle of the night, or pay extra to use a cartel tunnel underneath the border. It will do literally nothing to stop people from overstaying their visa/etc. which is approximately 25% of all illegal immigrants. And unless they build a wall of solid concrete there's a good chance people in Mexico are just going to try and cut through it anyways. If Trump didn't insist on making this a political thing, and instead said "I want to increase funding to the Border Patrol so they can decide the most important areas to build a wall" it would be a lot easier to support.

The housing thing I'm not smart enough to understand a solution to, but I feel like as long as real estate is prioritized as a fantastic money-making opportunity instead of "low-income people need a place to live too" it will always be a problem.

I like Bernie because I think even though solving healthcare is a difficult problem, it's one that needs to be addressed with major changes. I don't care about free public colleges, and I disagree with open borders. The difference is with Trump he will stop at nothing to enact his policies, whether it means pulling money out of anything to build a border wall, or doing it solely via Executive Order instead of doing the proper method through Congress. If Bernie said his main goal is abolishing ICE/CBP but the rest of the Dems totally disagreed with it (obv. you have your AOC's who would support it) it would never happen.

Anyways I think it's a moot point as the mainstream Dems don't support Bernie, and there isn't a single conservative (moderate or extreme) that supports his ideas either. I think the DNC will do anything to make sure he doesn't win the nomination too. And I don't necessarily disagree with that either, our best chance at winning is supporting a candidate that will appeal to moderates who voted for Trump in 2016. And that's not Bernie.

Biden I don't like because he seems out of touch with young people when he talks shit about weed and video games. He needs to realize alienating young people is not the best way to mobilize them to vote for you.

Buttigieg I know nothing about his policy ideas, only that he's gay and was the former mayor of South Bend. He's never going to convince your average straight white male conservative to vote for him though. I think if he won the nomination anti-LGBTQ sentiment would rise from the religious majority on the right.

Warren I don't think is strong enough to stand up to the Trump attacks. We need a candidate who is not going to let the Trump attacks distract from trying to win over swing voters.

I'm not sure who's going to win the nomination, but I feel like it's Biden as he represents the biggest name and the DNC likes him. If he prioritizes responding to Trump attacks over trying to win swing voters he's gonna lose though. One of the key mistakes Hill-dawg made was not campaigning enough in swing states in 2016.

[Buffalo Bob]

Originally Posted by mooby

Buttigieg I know nothing about his policy ideas, only that he's gay and was the former mayor of South Bend. He's never going to convince your average straight white male conservative to vote for him though.

I love how liberals single out white people and rip on them. Isn't that being racist? I had supervisory and training roles in some pretty large companies before becoming self employed in very diverse work forces. As a whole the minority males spewed a lot more venomous thoughts toward gay men than the white guys did. The biggest offenders were from our southern neighbors. I would love to see an honest poll taken on this subject. I would bet my right arm your average straight white male conservative doesn't discriminate against gay men anymore than Democrat voting males that migrated from Mexico.

My aunt is one of the few liberals I can discuss politics with. I always have fun when I ask her what Uncle Jorge (Mexican born) thinks of jotos (Spanish term for gay men) she always tells me she has learned to tune him out when he talks about them. She said straight alpha type males from Mexico will never accept gay men and nothing will change that.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Buffalo Bob

I love how liberals single out white people and rip on them.

I love how rightwingnuts make up lies about liberals to justify their racist views and policies.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Giantone

I love how rightwingnuts make up lies about liberals to justify their racist views and policies.

I love how giants' fans never add substance to these threads.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

[Buffalo Bob]

Originally Posted by Giantone

I love how rightwingnuts make up lies about liberals to justify their racist views and policies.

Once again your reading comprehension is selective. Mooby just ripped on white people. Why do you deny what is right in front of your face? I am starting to think you just post crap to try to get a rise out of people or you are going senile. My liberal white girlfriend rips on white people all the time.

[sdskinsfan2001]

Originally Posted by Buffalo Bob

I love how liberals single out white people and rip on them. Isn't that being racist? I had supervisory and training roles in some pretty large companies before becoming self employed in very diverse work forces. As a whole the minority males spewed a lot more venomous thoughts toward gay men than the white guys did. The biggest offenders were from our southern neighbors. I would love to see an honest poll taken on this subject. I would bet my right arm your average straight white male conservative doesn't discriminate against gay men anymore than Democrat voting males that migrated from Mexico.

My aunt is one of the few liberals I can discuss politics with. I always have fun when I ask her what Uncle Jorge (Mexican born) thinks of jotos (Spanish term for gay men) she always tells me she has learned to tune him out when he talks about them. She said straight alpha type males from Mexico will never accept gay men and nothing will change that.

Hispanics vote predominantly Democrat. So those people you're referencing are most likely going to vote Democrat or note vote at all.

Most straight white conservatives are obviously going to vote Republican most times so a gay candidate would have to try to sway their vote.

But so would any democratic candidate. I feel I'm about as conservative as it gets and I don't care if a candidate was gay. If he had conservative ideals he would get my vote easily.

Note - If I had to vote Democrat, Andrew Yang is my new favorite on their side. We would obviously disagree on a lot of things, but I find him likeable and I see him possibly being the most willing to work with both sides

[sdskinsfan2001]

What I want:

1. Balanced budget. Bush2, Obama, Trump presidencies have done nothing but make it worse with the spending and deficits. Way too many Americans don't make a big enough deal about our debt imo.

2. Limited federal government. 10th amendment rules. All powers not directly given to the feds are handled by the states.

3. Flat tax with no tax on anyone in the 1st 30K for single filers and 60K for joint filers. This number could be higher or lower but it would be no lower than on the 1st 20/40K.

4. Build the wall. Way too many people act like the cost of this wall is the magic point where we have to stop spending money. It's a drop in the bucket. Just using a conservative estimate of 1 billion spent every year on illegal immigration, if the wall stopped even just 1% of all crossers, it would save 10 million a year. The costs is way higher than that so the actual amount saved at 1% is exponentially higher.

4. Work on a deal that ties letting people already here stay be tied to legit cuts and savings from some of the Democrats sides babies. Both sides need to give something to get something. Or tie it into agreed spending on the wall. The far left and far right ruin this tho. Not willing to budge on anything.

5. Speed up the process of legal immigration combined with speeding up the process of deporting people that come illegally or that are already here and commit crimes.

6. Tort reform in the medical industry. These lawsuits do nothing but make lawyers rich and drive up medical prices for the rest of us.

7. Make barriers to the medical industry easier. We need way way way more companies competing against each other to make these drugs. The more competition the lower the prices.

8. Libertarian military policies. The older I get the more I agree with the Rand Paul's of the world. Sorry military complex, no more dying for your wallets.