WFT Quarterback Thread - Post SEASON 2021

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I wonder if the Jets are really ready to move on from Darnold. If so I bet we could get him for a 2nd or even a 3rd. I’d take a shot why not? Let’s be real, Gase is a QB ruiner

No way. A very high second--which we don't have--maybe. You think teams don't know the value of even a decent young QB? It is amazing how much posters on this board underestimate the picks it would take to get players, and also stand ready to offer robbery-like boatloads of picks for guys like Watson. I've seen posters say 3 first rounders, 2 second rounders, plus young players on rookie deals for Watson. Insane.

We could maybe get Darnold for a 2nd and a 3rd, but why should Jets rush to trade him until they pull chute on a QB in draft if that is their intent. Make sure you have QB you want then trade. I doubt Jaguars are moving out of #1 unless one of the posters offering 27 first rounders for Watson suddenly gets a GM job in the next month and trades our next 721 1st round picks for Lawrence. If I'm the Jets, I take calls for the #2 pick from QB needy teams. Maybe someone offers an absurd ransom, you never know, especially if they move down just a few spots and still get QB they like. Darnold has way more value if the top 4 or 5 QBs are off board late in 1st round, the Jets have taken a QB with #2 pick, and teams starving for a QB seeing no other viable options they love want Darnold. Worst case scenario, you let him play out rookie deal as insurance policy and get a 3rd comp pick year after. So trading him for 3rd makes little sense. If the Jets trade him for a 2nd, doing so after drafting QB of future makes more sense.

What a cavalier attitude to piss away draft picks with. Sure, a 2nd here, a third there, why not? LOL. Not how you build a team. A 2nd round pick is a long term starter at a lower leverage position if you draft smart. We have TONS of holes. We also need to get a QB on rookie deal. What we should be doing is using that 2nd or 3rd round pick to draft a QB we like.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I don't look at the quarterback position any different from other positions when it comes to the draft. I don't want them reaching for LB, WR, etc. in any round if he's not the best player on their board. Same with QB.

QB is different. You maybe reach a little, but not a lot. Often times, it is a choice between a high floor or high ceiling guy. Do you play it safe?

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by AnonEmouse

What we have to remember is Snyder had to convince Rivera to come here, and gave him assurances about control to do that. While he can maintain an improvement and a degree of success, Snyder isn't going to rock the boat because he knows Rivera will just walk. He's an established coach, with a rich NFL resume, well respected, wealthy and just got over cancer. He doesn't have any need to take any shit so he's far more likely to walk than give up ground to Snyder. And if Snyder loses Rivera like that, he'll never convince another top coach to come here.

Yup. And the problem is, to even get RR, he had to cede GM powers that most coaches should never have. EVERY coach given GM powers will begin making short-term decisions at the expense of the long-term as the end of their contract nears because they want to keep their jobs. It is why you segregate the two positions and should have GM over coach in power structure.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by SCRedskinsFan

Just a random observation regarding the QB position in today’s NFL. For all intents and purposes, a QB that is able to move exceedingly well and run outside the pocket is a must, to the exclusion of all others, like Mac Jones. And quarterbacks in the Russel Wilson mold seem to be much sought and preferred.

In the face of all that, who is the apparent GOAT at that position, who was drafted in the sixth round because of athletic shortcomings? And who just won the Super Bowl as the classic traditional pocket passer he has always been? So despite our excitement about the athleticism of the current crop of candidates, we would be well served that good wheels are not necessarily a reliable predictor of QB success. We would broaden our consideration to those who are tough minded, able to read the defense well, who have a quick release and accuracy even under stress, and who sport a high football IQ. I’m thinking that these qualities are undervalued as we look at QB candidates, and are more likely found in the later rounds of the draft.

Well spoken. Running QBs don't last. Never have, never will. They take bad hits eventually and get hurt, like Mahomes was this year, like Jackson, etc. More importantly, running becomes a substitute for learning to read Ds and be a pocket passer. Good wheels are not only not a good predictor of success, I would say the opposite is true.

Brees, Rodgers, Brady, etc., the guys in the hunt year after year, are traditional pocket passers that run very sparingly. Assuming you don't have a chicken arm, and can at least make all the basic throws, QB is 90% mental.
To me, Montana the GOAT, never cheated, never lost the big game. He could make all the throws but would be first to tell you he wasn't strong armed.

Trey Lance could be a stud, but has NEVER been forced to make pro reads. Assuming he can is a massive projection. Ala Haskins, though I doubt anyone in this year's draft will be as lazy as Haskins and improve so little. Learning to read offenses is NOT some trivial skill. Those advocating Trey Lance and similar guys have learned NOTHING from RGIII and Haskins. NOTHING. Neither could read a basic D. They destroyed it in college making quick simple plays on offenses loaded to gills with stud skill position players. You mitigate the risk of a QB busting by picking one that has already demonstrated ability to run a real pro offense and read Ds. Pocket passers are the players with longevity who lead teams deep into playoffs year after year. Pocket passers are what we should be looking to draft.

I like Mac Jones, and might take him over Lawrence, because of the mental aspects. Probably not, but maybe. I watched some film on both, limited sample size, and all I'm saying is, no way we get Lawrence, but Jones is the type of guy we should be targeting. I seriously doubt he is there at #19 but if he is, I take him in a heartbeat. His personality, work ethic, etc., remind me of Eli Manning, minus the ruinous alcoholism. People forget that Giants won more SBs than any other NFC team, prior to Brady moving to Bucs, over last two decades. With the statue pocket passer.

I think a team like New England will probably move up and take Jones. Trey Lance makes sense in the 2nd round given he has no proven ability to read Ds, but will be gone long before then I think. I love taking a flyer on a guy like Peyton Ramsey in the 3rd, 4th, or later. No brainer in the 4th for a team with no QB, if he's there. People say our OC wants a running QB for his "system" but great coordinators adapt the system to the player.

A VERY important observation about pocket passers, is that you can actually find a good one outside the first round and outside the top-10. You can find a good pocket passer in later rounds and have a solid long-term starter. You can't generally find a guy that can throw and run like a WR in the later rounds.

Mac Jones if he's there at 19, which I doubt he'll be. I think he'll be gone in top-10, and no way he slides by Pats at 15. I'm NOT a huge fan of trading up, but if Jones is sitting there past 10 it becomes interesting. Dallas and Giants are 10-11, both have their QB, but would they help a division rival snipe theirs or rather help Pats? You'd, going by charts, be talking a 2nd and 4th or 5th rounder. So you would get Jones and still have 2 third round picks. I don't love trades like this, but it at least isn't a total mortgaging of future, and I think the price would ultimately be higher because of bidding war QB needy teams, and would probably take a 2nd and 3rd this year minimum. Too high a price methinks.

And sign Trent Williams to 2-year deal. :-) LOL. LOL. LOL. Bruce Allen, the gift that keeps on giving. . .

At a minimum, we need to take a flyer on a pocket passer like Ramsey in 3rd or 4th round.

[FrenchSkin]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

If they are going to name it something like that , you would see the team slowly transitioning to it. The fact that they have branded the WFT logo now on all merchandise and at the facility itself seems like they are going to be keeping that logo for good.

The thing is when you actually read the process they're putting out there, nothing is done to make you think that they want to keep WFT, nothing is said to make you think they've picked a name yet, and they sure wouldn't leak any hint about the next name before they reveal it (or maybe some unofficial leaks to test reactions but not from the official team website/socials).

WFT might very well be in the narrowed down list of options, but I don't think they've made a choice yet, and the narrative they're putting out there is about a long process to pick a NEW name, one that'll last 100+ years.

[skinsfaninok]

Peter King on Sirius XM

"Houston would want Chase Young and multiple 1's, Washington is not doing that so they are out"

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Peter King on Sirius XM

"Houston would want Chase Young and multiple 1's, Washington is not doing that so they are out"

Houston's price is going to come down if they become serious about moving on from Watson. To me they are pulling a Bruce Allen and making outrageous demands at the moment, so it is hard to take anything serious (remember when he asked for Denzel Ward in a Trent Williams potential trade with the Browns?)

[MTK]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Peter King on Sirius XM

"Houston would want Chase Young and multiple 1's, Washington is not doing that so they are out"

CY is worth multiple picks himself, so yeah I'd bow out too. The price for Watson is going to be absurd.

[skinsfaninok]

He's a damn good QB but yeah I'm out on that..

[skinsfaninok]

UPDATE: A team asked Devonta Smith point blank which QB was better, Mac Jones or Tua Tagovailoa. Devonta Smith definitively said Jones is the better quarterback

(H/T:
@AlbertBreer
)

[SunnySide]

Fuck Houston.

Looks like Mac Jones hype machine may be leap frogging Lance for the no. 3 Qb taken.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Fuck Houston.

Looks like Mac Jones hype machine may be leap frogging Lance for the no. 3 Qb taken.

Saw a couple mocks that had him in the top 10 and Lance around 15.. I'd trade up to 15 and grab Lance if that's the case.

[simbosargos75]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Fuck Houston.

Looks like Mac Jones hype machine may be leap frogging Lance for the no. 3 Qb taken.

I think you mean #4. There's almost no chance either is the 3rd qb selected.

[skinsfaninok]

To
@nyjets
fans. Anything you hear about Zach Wilson talent-trait wise....you hear about Sam Darnold.

The only reason to draft Wilson and move on from Sam is to completely re-set the financial timetable at QB.

Darnold is a more talented player skill wise

Dan Orlovsky



I'd also be cool with this

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by simbosargos75

I think you mean #4. There's almost no chance either is the 3rd qb selected.

Yup youre right. I meant 4.