The Obama Years- A GOP love story

[NC_Skins]

Thought I'd start a fresh thread where the Independents, Repubs, Libertarians, Green Party, Tea Party, and Democrats duke it out with politics. The current hot topic is the fiscal cliff.

GOP 'fiscal cliff' plan echoes failed budget talks - Yahoo! News

Can somebody explain to me why the GOP are dead set in raising taxes for the ultra rich? Why can't the rest of the conservative base see who they serve and elect somebody else? Haven't we heard their speil before? Taxes will kill jobs. They said the same thing during Clinton's years and guess what? They were wrong.


My guess is they'll raise the taxes on the rich, only if they add in loopholes that they can avoid this increase, thereby negating it. What is it with these assholes?

It's really simple. Close ALL (and I mean every last one) tax loopholes, let ultra rich who've bypassed taxes all these years pay a higher tax that the middle class had to cover. After about 4 years of this, drop the tax rate so that middle and upper class taxes are equal in percentage. Also, remove all corporate tax loopholes, and lower the corporate tax rate. Cut spending across the board and profit.

**** this, I'm running for President next go around. Even I can get this simple idea down.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Thought I'd start a fresh thread where the Independents, Repubs, Libertarians, Green Party, Tea Party, and Democrats duke it out with politics. The current hot topic is the fiscal cliff.

GOP 'fiscal cliff' plan echoes failed budget talks - Yahoo! News

Can somebody explain to me why the GOP are dead set in raising taxes for the ultra rich? Why can't the rest of the conservative base see who they serve and elect somebody else? Haven't we heard their speil before? Taxes will kill jobs. They said the same thing during Clinton's years and guess what? They were wrong.


My guess is they'll raise the taxes on the rich, only if they add in loopholes that they can avoid this increase, thereby negating it. What is it with these assholes?

It's really simple. Close ALL (and I mean every last one) tax loopholes, let ultra rich who've bypassed taxes all these years pay a higher tax that the middle class had to cover. After about 4 years of this, drop the tax rate so that middle and upper class taxes are equal in percentage. Also, remove all corporate tax loopholes, and lower the corporate tax rate. Cut spending across the board and profit.

**** this, I'm running for President next go around. Even I can get this simple idea down.

The dems have said they want to raise taxes for anyone making over $250,000 a year and even you have said your against that.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

The dems have said they want to raise taxes for anyone making over $250,000 a year and even you have said your against that.

No I haven't.

[dmek25]

im not against that. seems like something that should have been done before

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

im not against that. seems like something that should have been done before

That's because you don't make that much money or have 33 to 35% of your income going to pay federal taxes. That does not even include the other state, property, or sales taxes. Some making a little over $250,000 per year are paying 40 to 50% of their income into taxes. Not sure how anyone could be for that. I know several people who make over $250,000 per year and they work harder then anyon I know and earn every penny they make.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

That's because you don't make that much money or have 33 to 35% of your income going to pay federal taxes. That does not even include the other state, property, or sales taxes. Some making a little over $250,000 per year are paying 40 to 50% of their income into taxes. Not sure how anyone could be for that. I know several people who make over $250,000 per year and they work harder then anyon I know and earn every penny they make.

The problem I mostly have are the tax havens and loopholes the ultra rich use to avoid taxes. You have your guys like Mitt dodging taxes like a mofo and paying some stupid rate like 14% or lower (which is why he didn't show his taxes in length).

The guys making 250k aren't dodging taxes, aren't using tax loopholes. (for the most part) Personally, I would move that tax increase to 1 million and then close ALL tax loopholes. It's never going to happen though because the people voting for it are millionaires themselves.

[NC_Skins]

Jon Stewart summarizes GOP budget plan: Jump off the fiscal cliff voluntarily | The Raw Story

Jon Stewart brilliant as always.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

The problem I mostly have are the tax havens and loopholes the ultra rich use to avoid taxes. You have your guys like Mitt dodging taxes like a mofo and paying some stupid rate like 14% or lower (which is why he didn't show his taxes in length).

The guys making 250k aren't dodging taxes, aren't using tax loopholes. (for the most part) Personally, I would move that tax increase to 1 million and then close ALL tax loopholes. It's never going to happen though because the people voting for it are millionaires themselves.

Okay, ignoring the philosophical/ethical issues underpinning the pros and cons on wealth redistribution in this fashion - let's just say we do this. You don't come anwhere near closing the revenue/spending gap. It's barely a start. I haven't googled the numbers but let's just say such a move covers 30% of the revenue/spending deficit (and I think 30% is a huge overstatement).

Where's the other 70% coming from?

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Okay, ignoring the philosophical/ethical issues underpinning the pros and cons on wealth redistribution in this fashion - let's just say we do this. You don't come anwhere near closing the revenue/spending gap. It's barely a start. I haven't googled the numbers but let's just say such a move covers 30% of the revenue/spending deficit (and I think 30% is a huge overstatement).

Where's the other 70% coming from?

There really isn't any philosophical debate on "sharing the wealth". Fact is, the rich scumbags have been dodging taxes and paying less PERCENTAGE of taxes as compared to everybody else. That's not equal. So, let those assholes eat cake for a decade(like we have) before moving the the tax rate back down EQUAL for everybody. (above poverty level) That way we can all pay the same rate and nobody has a upper advantage when it comes to taxes being paid.

More ways to save money and increase revenue.

1) Corporate taxes. No sense in corporations paying 0 taxes on 14 billion in profits. (GE) NO sense of Google paying 2% tax rate back in 2010 when they score billions. (a few examples below)
Ten giant U.S. companies avoiding income taxes: Sen. Bernie Sanders list - Lynn Sweet

A nice article here:
Majority of corporations avoid federal income taxes - study - Aug. 12, 2008

I also think they should lower the overall corporate tax, and close ALL the loopholes.


2) Subsidies to oil industry or any other corporation. I think this is self explanatory.


Also, you have to cut spending, and I'm fine with cutting spending across the board. The one interesting point to note though, infrastructure spending helps out the economy.

That's just off the top of my head. I'm sure I can (and will) think of more.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

The problem I mostly have are the tax havens and loopholes the ultra rich use to avoid taxes. You have your guys like Mitt dodging taxes like a mofo and paying some stupid rate like 14% or lower (which is why he didn't show his taxes in length).

The guys making 250k aren't dodging taxes, aren't using tax loopholes. (for the most part) Personally, I would move that tax increase to 1 million and then close ALL tax loopholes. It's never going to happen though because the people voting for it are millionaires themselves.

First off Mitts not dodging taxes he is paying what he owes and he did not make the tax laws. You think that Obama and other Dems don't also take the deductions or pay the tax rate they owe and nothing more? I'm sure you also know that the reason people know how much Obama donated to charity last year was because it was on his taxes as a write off (your terms he was dodging paying taxes on that money). You also say people making 250k aren't taking tax deductions and I'd say your crazy. You don't take tax dedections? They are not loopholes they are tax code and anyone using them is not dodging taxes. Even the poor take tax deductions on money they didn't even pay to get a tax credit and refund even if they didn't pay taxes.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

First off Mitts not dodging taxes he is paying what he owes and he did not make the tax laws. You think that Obama and other Dems don't also take the deductions or pay the tax rate they owe and nothing more? I'm sure you also know that the reason people know how much Obama donated to charity last year was because it was on his taxes as a write off (your terms he was dodging paying taxes on that money). You also say people making 250k aren't taking tax deductions and I'd say your crazy. You don't take tax dedections? They are not loopholes they are tax code and anyone using them is not dodging taxes. Even the poor take tax deductions on money they didn't even pay to get a tax credit and refund even if they didn't pay taxes.

Hiding money in offshore accounts and using loopholes is dodging taxes. I didn't say they were doing anything illegal, I simply said they were dodging taxes.....and they are.

The loopholes I'm referring to are the ones not offered or afforded to the peasants.

[dmek25]

Originally Posted by firstdown

That's because you don't make that much money or have 33 to 35% of your income going to pay federal taxes. That does not even include the other state, property, or sales taxes. Some making a little over $250,000 per year are paying 40 to 50% of their income into taxes. Not sure how anyone could be for that. I know several people who make over $250,000 per year and they work harder then anyon I know and earn every penny they make.

not sure what you call good money, but i make around 100 grand a year. thats plenty for me

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by dmek25

not sure what you call good money, but i make around 100 grand a year. thats plenty for me

My point was most people that say people making $250,000 should pay more taxes are not in their shoes paying 35 to 50% of their income to taxes.

[RedskinRat]

Where's the flat tax I asked for?

[That Guy]

mitt said something like a 50k deduction limit. ending loopholes like farm subsidies for people making over 500k etc wouldn't be a terrible idea either.